AS DELIVERED
Dan Senor: Good morning. It is great to be with you. We have three distinguished guests this morning. Immediate to my left right here, a man who needs no introduction to this audience, an American hero, a member of the Senate Armed Services Committee, Senator John McCain.
Senator Gillibrand: They're excited about John.
Dan Senor: And next to Senator John McCain, a man who was inside Israel's military establishment for 40 years, his most recent position was head of military intelligence for the IDF, he's participated in two nonproliferation operations on behalf of Israel, the first of which was as a young pilot in 1981. He was one of the pilots in the Israeli operation into Osiraq in Iraq. Please help me welcome General Amos Yadlin.
And a distinguished member of the U.S. Senate Armed Services Committee, a newer member to the Senate, but has played a key role in helping to combat anti-Israel sentiment at the United Nations in a number of roles through the Senate, please help me welcome Senator Kirsten Gillibrand.
Senator Gillibrand: Thank you. Thank you.
Dan Senor: I want to jump right into the discussion. We have a short period of time and a lot of territory to cover. Senator McCain, I want to start with you. Iran is on everybody's mind. You have been working and thinking about the issue of Iran for a very long time, long before it was on many people's radar screen. In short, what can the United States and Israel do, working together, to deal with Iran and prevent Iran from acquiring a nuclear weapons capability?
Senator McCain: All right. Thank you, Dan. And thank you, all for the very warm welcome. And may I say what a great honor it is to be with General Yadlin who and I once flew the same type of airplane. The difference is that he used to shoot people down and I got shot down.
But other than that—and I also want to tell you that I've watched a number of senators come to the United States Senate. This senator from New York has done a magnificent job in defense in the state of Israel and defense for freedom and—Senator Gillibrand: You're so kind.
Senator McCain: And we recently had an encounter with the president of Egypt over some of the remarks that he had previously made and I can assure you, he will not forget the senator from New York from that encounter. I'm very proud of her. What's happening in Iran, obviously the centrifuges are spinning. The latest effort at conciliation and some kind of agreement with the Iranians have failed and it's very clear that they are on the path to having a nuclear weapon.
And I don't think it's a question of whether, it's obviously a question of when. We have one of the most foremost experts, my dear and hero Ehud Barak, who is very well aware of this issue. Look, the Iranians are watching what happened in North Korea. They just set off another nuclear device. We made concession after concession under both Bush and Obama Administrations and it turned into failure.
So Dan, I know we have a short amount of time. I think that this latest offer on the part of the United States and our allies was doomed to failure and in Tehran I think it is viewed as a weakness because of additional concessions. But it is vitally important that in Tehran they understand that there is no space between the United States and Israel, that there is no space between the two countries. And I'm going to give you a little straight talk, they believe right now in Tehran that there is space between the two countries.
If there's one thing that I would hope that the president's reelection would motivate him to work more closely with the Israeli government and take concerted action if that action is necessary. Thank you, Dan.
Dan Senor: Senator Gillibrand, let me just pick up on where Senator McCain left off. It is true that there can be no daylight between the U.S. and Israel when dealing with Iran, but what about the rest of the world, the international community? You've seen this in some of the work you've dealt with helping Israel in the U.N. What can the U.S. Congress and the administration do to reduce this perception that Israel and America are at it alone?
Senator Gillibrand: Well, as a member of Congress we have used that platform as a way to not only show our commitment to Israel, but make the statement that our fundamental securities are intertwined. Our national security is intertwined with Israel's. And so for example, we have a resolution from last week that basically says we will stand by Israel, both economically and militarily with regard to Iran. When the U.N. makes statements and we're—Dan Senor: It's all right to clap.
Senator Gillibrand: When the U.N. makes statements, particularly the Human Rights Council we have to stand up to them. So whether it means we are standing against Durban II or Durban III, we lead those letters out of the Senate, whether it's to cry on the Goldstone report, whether it's standing up for Israel's right not only to prevent the flotilla from crossing, but actually has a duty to do so.
Those statements have to be made immediately by American leaders, because I agree with Senator McCain, there should be no sunlight and we have to continue to show that we are hand-in-hand as allies and as friends and as fundamentally committed to not only Israel's security, but United States national security.
Dan Senor: Great. General Yadlin, I mentioned that you were involved with two nonproliferation activities. One I sited, because you've sited it, your work as a pilot in the '81 Osiraq Operation, one you have not personally sited, but I can. According to international reports, you were head of military intelligence and involved with the Israeli operation dealing with the Syria nuclear reactor in 2007. Based on those two experiences and now what the West will be dealing with, with a possible third nonproliferation operation, what can the U.S. and Israel do together? You've heard from Senators McCain and Gillibrand from the U.S. perspective. What about from the Israeli perspective, how do you see it day to day?
General Yadlin: Yeah. I think we all share the same data, the same intelligence. We are now on the same page in the foundation of the problem. We are also on the same page on the strategic goal to prevent Iran from being nuclear. But between the floor and the ceiling of the problem there are doors and windows that we are not in the same place and we should be much closer on how to prevent Iran from being nuclear.
Because 2012 passed with giving more time for negotiation, for sanctions, for reaching an agreement, for diplomacy and the time is running out in 2013. There are three penalties (sic) that makes us a little bit different on Iran when it comes to policy. It's different trauma, it's different trigger and maybe not enough trust. So we have to develop that even though we come with different traumas, we are the Israelis coming with the Holocaust, we are 6 million Israelis listening to Ahmadinejad calling to the annihilation of Israel.
We take it very seriously, very seriously. You came with another trauma, the name is Iraq and you don't want, and justly so, to go to another war, but this is not a war. This is a one-night operation and we should speak about it.
Dan Senor: Senator McCain, it's hard to consider what is going on vis-à-vis Iran in isolation, the whole region is in turmoil. A former Israeli diplomat said to me that what Israel is doing right now, when there's talk about Israel, for instance, making territorial concessions in the context of a peace agreement, that Israel's being asked to pitch a tent in the middle of a hurricane. That if you look what's happening in Egypt, you look what's happening in Jordan, recent parliamentary elections, 25 percent of the parliament elected Islamists, you look what's happening in Syria, in Lebanon.
You recently returned from Egypt. You spent some time with President Morsi. This has been one of the cornerstones of Israeli security for 30 years, that relationship with Egypt. Based on your recent trip, what you see in the region and the turmoil, how does Israel consider the range of challenges it's facing?
Senator McCain: I have not seen the Middle East and the world in a more dangerous situation in my lifetime. During the Cold War it was very dangerous, but it was very clear what the challenges were. We are seeing the Middle East, in particular, but the world in the midst of change. I believe that Syria is a national and international shame that we have allowed Bashar Assad to massacre 70,000, 80,000 people and we have not done anything about it.
It's an unfair fight. The Russians and Iranians are sending weapons. The Iranian Revolutionary Guard are on the ground. Eighty-thousand people, at least, have been massacred. Lebanon and Jordan are in great danger of being destabilized and the United States watches. Humanitarian aid doesn't get it.
It's very interesting; you go to a refugee camp and meet the leaders of that refugee camp and the woman says, Senator McCain, these young children you see through this camp, they will take revenge on those who refuse to help them. Jihadists are flowing into Syria in large numbers. They are the ravist fighters. The arms and equipment that you're hearing about, a lot of that is going to the wrong people from Gulf States.
It is a situation, which destabilizes Lebanon, destabilizes Jordan and eventually poses a threat to the very existence of the state of Israel. And it's time the United States established this no-fly zone, provided arms and equipment to those who are fighting for freedom and it's time that Israel help them in whatever way possible that we can.
Dan Senor: Senator Gillibrand, I mentioned Jordan as well—sorry.
Senator McCain: We need members of the national security team who are pro-Israel, not anti-Israel.
Dan Senor: Senator Gillibrand, I mentioned Jordan. You've spent some time looking at Jordan. If you go east there is concern based on the electoral developments I cited and about the increasingly sense that the monarchy there is wobbly. How should we and Israel think about this important ally of the United States and one of two countries in the region that has a real peace agreement with Israel?
Senator Gillibrand: Well, you're quite right. We need allies in the region and Jordan is being destabilized for a number of reasons. Not only is the Muslim Brotherhood rising in political power, but as these fighters come across you have the risk of militancy in Jordan and that is going to create challenges.
You also have a Syrian refugee population of 400,000 now in Jordan, which is a huge financial strain on already wavering economy. Jordan doesn't have a lot of natural resources. Most of their economy is driven by government, the U.S. and being able to provide aid to Jordan, allow them to get resources from the IMF is essential. So our role with regard to Jordan, we have to continue to help steward them, help them keep some measure of calm and be able to help them transition through this difficult time.
And I think our role with regard to helping Syrian refugees is significant. We're going to have to be a friend and an ally, because it is being destabilized right now. I think, as Senator McCain said, the whole region is in fluid flux; it's very difficult. Egypt, when we visited with President Morsi, Senator McCain was very clear, as was the delegation that they have to stop the flow of these weapons through the Sinai into Gaza.
So last week's news that we are now going to stop the tunnels and beginning to flood the tunnels is helpful, but we have to draw Morsi closer to us. That is why we have to engage him and why Secretary Kerry's trip over there saying, we'll give you $250 million is a step in the right direction, because they need IMF funding, they have to focus on their economy. And without a stable economy there you will continue to see a slide towards regimes and leadership that are not going to be pro-U.S., not going to be pro-Israel.
Dan Senor: General Yadlin, you look around the region as Senators McCain and Gillibrand have sited. Take us inside Israeli decision-making. The Israelis, it's our understanding, that view Iran, the possibility of getting a nuclear weapons capability, as the biggest concern. But you talk about all these other countries, Egypt, Jordan, Lebanon, Syria; you head further east, even Iraq, increased instability in Iraq now that U.S. forces are gone. So Israeli policymakers and strategists look at the map. And how do they rank and prioritize which issue they've got to deal with tomorrow?
General Yadlin: Yeah. When I was a fighter pilot I used to have a couple of principles. One was never panic. Second, never be in euphoria; this is too dangerous. Be slightly paranoid and that's what we are. By the way, Senator McCain saved me from prison, because we flew the same airplane, A4, very tiny cockpit. When you eject you break your two legs. So I was in flight school when you already—the senator is in prison in Vietnam and he'd broke his two legs.
And when I was hit over Egypt in 1973 he immediately came to my mind and I say, I am not going to eject. Maybe I will crash, but I crossed the canal back to the safe side. Anyway, thank you, [inaudible]. Thank you.
Dan Senor: This is what we call the shared cooperation, shared intelligence, sharing between America and Israel. AIPAC at its best.
General Yadlin: In this Middle East, which is unstable, very dangerous, the only ally of Israel that you can really count on, the only ally of the United States that you can really count on is Israel.
It's the only place that after you come and give some help, material and equipment they really love you and not hate you. So Israel is another aircraft carrier over there. I'm quite concerned that another aircraft carrier went back from where it should be to make the military option credible even though it's not preferable, but must be credible to make sure that the other options will work.
And Israel is there and every day on the ground. There is a cooperation between the two militaries, the two intelligence. There is ongoing dialogue between the two defense establishments to see how we cope with the same strength, because nonproliferation in Iran is not only an Israeli issue. It's a U.S. vital national interest issue.
And the terrorism that you see all over is an American national security issue and the stability in the Middle East. And even though Senator Lieberman told me lately that the fact that Israel and the United States discovered natural gas and Shell Oil is the proof that there is Almighty and he's listening to our prayers.
However, you cannot really pivot to the specific, that the Middle East is very important. Maybe there is oil, but the price of oil is happening there. So it's a very important area to both of us and if we do it together, if we cope together with the nuclearization of Iran, with the terrorism result will emerge in the so-called Arab Spring I think the two countries would be better off.
Dan Senor: We are running out of time and I want to move to just the closing part of this discussion. I want to ask each of you, starting with Senator Gillibrand, this room of people, this amazing collection of American citizens, citizen activists who are going to engage their representatives in Congress, this week during the policy conference tomorrow, and make the case for the U.S.-Israel relationship and why it is a centerpiece of America's security, stability and position in the world. What is your message to this group of dynamic and energetic activists as they go to make their case? How can they make it most effectively?
Senator Gillibrand: Well, first, I want to say thank you. It makes such a difference that you come to Washington, that you talk to your legislators, talk to your Congress members and senators about what matters so much to you, because there is so much more work that has to be done. Even as Senator McCain and I are working hard on things, like Iran sanctions we find out that we have to engage the European central bankers to make sure they're not allowing money to flow still into Iran.
These are issues that need advocacy every single day. So I just want to thank you for being so engaged and knowing how important your voice is to our democracy here in America.
Dan Senor: General Yadlin, you're normally at your—very important, to thank the Institute for National Security Studies in Israel. But as you travel the world and you spend time in places, Jerusalem, Tel Aviv to Washington, D.C., what do you think would be the most effective case, from an Israeli perspective, for American Congressional representatives to hear?
General Yadlin: I think this crowd deserves a lot of credit what they are doing. So they have to continue with the very good jobs that they are doing. I think the most important thing at that point is to fight the DBS, their wrong narrative about Israel, because Israel is a just cause. Israel has the moral ground. Israel should be in the same values that we all believe in the past that Israel represents.
And there is now a war. It is not a war with airplanes, not a war with tanks. It's a war with speeches, with the wrong narratives, with a lot of lies and these people should fight it as we are doing it. We don't have—let's say, we should create the structure to fight this war in the same structures that fight the kinetic war, but this war of wars is really important. So come to Israel, see what Israel is all about, meet the young generation.
As chief of intelligence I used to tell them, guys, I have a problem; I don't know what to do about it. Do you have an idea? And these people, 25 years old, 26 years old, young captains, they went for a month, they went for three months. They came back with the most innovative idea, that will day there will be books about it. And come and see them; they love you, love them, and together we can do it.
Dan Senor: And lastly, final word goes to Senator John McCain. What is your message to this group?
John McCain: I often tell my Baptist friends that it's hard trying to do the Lord's work in the city of Satan. It gets harder - every single day. By the way, your ambassador does a great job. He really does. Fine job. Despite the fact that he became became a socialist in the Ivy League, but other than that, he's—My friends, on Iran, the only way to dissuade the Iranians from the path they're on is for them to believe the United States and Israel will act together. On Egypt, Egypt is the heart and soul of the Arab world and we may pay careful attention, and we must gauge our aid to Egypt as to their progress. We cannot just give them a blank check. But we don't want to break the Camp David Accords, either. They're a very serious issue.
Everybody in this room had something to do besides be here this morning and this evening. I want to thank you because you're serving a cause greater than your self-interest. You're serving the cause of democracy and freedom in a part of the world where it's a very scarce commodity. I want to thank you from the bottom of my heart because we are in the most dangerous times, as I began my comments.
And your participation and your involvement and your engagement and your support and your commitment to peace has never been as important as it is today. Thank you and God Bless.
Dan Senor: I want to thank you Senators John McCain, Kirsten Gillibrand, General Amos Yadlin. Thank you, all of you, for participating.